the miceage.com cds?

[Dirk]

just some sort of basic law-information:

A work of art is automatically copyrighted as soon as it is created as long as it is a genuine work of art or (if it is based on an existing work of art) adds a certain degree of new elements (labor going into it). This is true for a wide variety of works of art, basically everything that involves creativity in some way, e.g. texts, drawings, sketches, designs, layout etc. Nobody has to apply for a copyright and these works of art are copyrighted the momented they are created no matter wether the copyright owner puts a copyright notice next to it. Therefore Disney automatically owns the copyrights (or at least the rights to use them) e.g. for their characters. But you also own the copyrights for the texts you post here.
There is a certain minimum standard for works of art to be considered copyright-worthy. E.g. a name (like Disney) is not protected by copyright, but depending on the state we are talking about a unique wordcreation might be (this would be a border-case).

Trademarks and other protection rights on the other hand need to be applied for and have certain minimum requirements.


About the photo question: again this is different from state to state. Basically you can say that if on private property (=WDW) the owner can tell you what to do and what not to do. Usually the tickets or signs at the ticket booths / small print in the reservation tells you that you agree to the general rules of WDW. For theme parks they usually state that you are allowed to take photos for private use only, but prohibited to publish them, sell them use them in articles etc. That is how they prevent unofficial guidebooks from just snapping away and publishing the photos.


To go into more detail contact an American lawyer



Yours
Dirk

 

[Kenster]

I think we are a unique niche of music enthusiasts here and what we like here generally works for the public.

I must say I was surprised to read that the haunted mansion ride thru on the official cd was from a "fan based collection." It's because of a fan that the material is obtained? Simply amazing. Perhaps there is a purpose for us after all.

As far as fan based albums go, GGG has done a nice job of putting his compilations together. There are other fantasy remixes out there though where I cannot fully say that. Some folks throw in background music where there shouldn't be any to "spice" things up, ignoring historical accuracy. I've heard attraction elements out of order, and have even heard "made up stuff" to replace what's really there. Hats off to you GGG.

I don't believe this to be a company threatening thing. This is a company promoting thing. It appears that Disney is coming around to our likes and needs too. I hope that Randy hits us hard and heavy with all kinds of stuff while he is able.

As for selling these fan based compilations, I think the seller is taking a big risk and is out of line. I saw mention of the extinct-attractions club. I remember all too clearly how this guy constantly bombarded the a.d.d. newsgroup with his pleas for film footage, only to be blasted by the newsgroup as being profit driven and greedy and yet, he continues on.







































give you the attention deficit disorder versions.

 

[X-S Tech]

In the case of the Haunted Mansion CD that DL released, I too had heard that the flow through was from an unofficial source. What I want to know is, with the Mansion currently operational, why didn't Disney just use the material that plays there? In other words, I can understand for Adventures thru Inner Space, maybe WDI has lost some of the material and it is necessary to search elsewhere for some of it. But don't they have everything they need for the Mansion? Or is this just a case of the Fanmade mix being practically done and ready to go, so it was just quicker than doing a new mix?

 

[Kenster]

My cat stepped on the mouse and posted prematurely, sorry for the gap

 

[Grinning Ghost]

X-S Tech,

You've got it nearly right; It was already made (from the ride's actual audio loops), and so it cost them next to nothing. The other problem is Disney legal. They won't let just anyone root around in their vaults, not even Disney employees without all sorts of clearances, and it's nearly impossible to get clearance from legal. Even WDI, who produced the CD, didn't have full access to the ride audio. Only one person was allowed any access to some of the original recording sessions. All that was changed on the ride-through was the addition of the extra Leota spiel and the Updated Attic scene. The rest was the original, fan-assembled version. They didn't even have access to the seance music loop, so they used the music from the original ride-through under the new spiel, which still had Leota's original spiel and bell bleeding through. The "new" lines are also in the wrong place; They are actually the third and sixth verses (for a total of seven). The two verses were dropped sometime after the face of Leota was filmed, as you can spot the two edits where they were originally during repeated viewing. I presume they wanted to keep it down to one minute. Since WDI didn't have access to all the individual audio elements, they couldn't remix it to include the extra lines, so they made do with what they had. (This is my interpretation of events as was told to me, so some may be inaccurate.)

It really all boils down to money. It would have cost way too much to give it a proper restoration and remix, on something they weren't sure would turn a large enough profit to justify the initial cost. It took me nearly two years to gather all the inidividual audio elements, and then about three months to restore each one as best I could. (Some are in really bad shape.) It took a couple more months to get the mix right. I can only imagine how much such a project would have cost to make from scratch. However, after the HM 34th was completed, I was given some high-quality copies of some of the original recording sessions, and did a complete remaster and rebuild in less than a month! And that was on a part-time basis in the evenings...

GG

 

[skoolpsyk]

However, after the HM 34th was completed, I was given some high-quality copies of some of the original recording sessions, and did a complete remaster and rebuild ...
GG

Aaarrghhh, why do you say such things that torture me so!?! must have....must have....

 

[Kenster]

Your knowledge of the Haunted Mansion CD is very interesting and an eye opener to say the least.

I had no idea about the "new" Leota tracks being in the wrong place so, when I did a remix for fun, I left them out. The bell "bleed" at the beginning of the seance room always seemed out of place as it would ring first and I knew it was from the "ringing a bell" verse.

I did catch the added attic material in there. It sounds clean compared to the rest of the material.

What about the horse sound effect out front? Have any of you actually heard it? Is it just bad timing on my part when I pass by the invisible horse? Or did the effect work at one time and was later put down?

Is there any chance a better version could be used for the Haunted Mansion OA?

What seems disturbing is that the people that made the CD could not have access to the material they were trying to present. I hope this is not the case for Randy's current project!

Because I am not in the know about how the DLF tracks were selected I wonder how they were. Didn't these tracks come from the vault? I know that Club 33 and the BTMRR tracks are goofs, right? How did those get involved?

I'm getting off topic here. Thanks for the Information.

 

[X-S Tech]

I had heard a fan mix of the mansion (supposedly the Roberta Brubaker version that WDI later used) before the 30th CD came out and the invisible horse was one of the things that was missing from this version, presumably because she was trying to represent the Mansion in it's original form and the horse didn't appear (so to speak) until more recently.

I do remember hearing the horse sfx once or twice when it was first installed. Haven't heard it in quite some time but then I haven't had to stand nearby for very long.

 

[Grinning Ghost]

What about the horse sound effect out front? Have any of you actually heard it? Is it just bad timing on my part when I pass by the invisible horse? Or did the effect work at one time and was later put down?
...
What seems disturbing is that the people that made the CD could not have access to the material they were trying to present. I hope this is not the case for Randy's current project! ...

I've never heard the horse, but then I've never been to the one in DL. I'm told it was used around the time that the CD was produced, but it never appears on any of the numerous home videos that I use for reference, even those from that time period.

Hard to say what Legal would give Randy access to. I know they didn't let him have access to the Tiki Room audio. The current version is just compiled from the DLF and other existing official tracks. In some cases, it's a question of having to pay the musicians involved again, just as if they had come back to the studio to record all over again. I think that was the problem he was having with Mary Poppins. Not sure if that would apply to park audio or not. Or it may have been simply a budget issue, and they told him to use what was already available. You'd have to ask him directly.

GG

 

[Grinning Ghost]

I had heard a fan mix of the mansion (supposedly the Roberta Brubaker version that WDI later used) before the 30th CD came out and the invisible horse was one of the things that was missing from this version, presumably because she was trying to represent the Mansion in it's original form and the horse didn't appear (so to speak) until more recently.

I do remember hearing the horse sfx once or twice when it was first installed. Haven't heard it in quite some time but then I haven't had to stand nearby for very long.

The Brubaker original didn't have the horse. I forgot about it until it was just brought up. I never really liked the "official" version all that much, so I haven't listened to it in well over a year. Glad to hear that the ghost horse was indeed in use at one time.

GG