Alternate Disney Soundtracks question!


L

Louis Gonzalez

Member
Hello friends,
There are a few Disney soundtracks I have on vinyl that are different from the original soundtrack. This used to bother me back when they were the only choice. But thanks to Randy Thornton, now we have most of the original soundtracks, making the alternate versions a fun alternate listen. For example, the Alice in Wonderland LP was completely re-recorded with a different cast, the Sleeping Beauty LP had different vocal recordings by the same performers, the Mary Poppins LP has different edits with a few different music parts to make it work better and even includes the intermission music!, or course, we all know the alternate Haunted Mansion LP. So, I just mentioned 4 titles above. My question is, what other LPs had alternate soundtrack recordings different than the original movies' soundtrack?
Thanks in advance!!!

For rare Disney music got o: http://cgi6.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?View...t=3&rows=25
 
T

Tim Hollis

Member
What a leading question! Yes, most of the movies had both an actual film soundtrack LP and a "second cast" version as well. The "second cast" recordings sold for a cheaper price (usually $1.98, as compared with $3.98 or above for the actual soundtracks).

In the upcoming book (see another posted topic), we cover the "second cast" recordings in quite a bit of depth. Some people dislike these LP's because they aren't performed by the same voices heard in the movie, but to me that just maks them all the more interesting. It would be as if someone said they didn't like the Disney comic books or Little Golden Books because they weren't drawn by the same artists as the cartoons.

So that is the short version of the story of the "second cast" LP's. The cmplete story will be told in 300 pages or so.
 
musicrazy

musicrazy

Member
In my experience,there seems to be a wide variety of outtakes in the soundtrack catagory.
1) A Peter Pan soundtrack with the instrumentation with the vocals removed for The Second Star to the Right. On this same cassette are the Jimmie Dodd versions of Following the Leader and Your Mother and Mine, as well as the Kathryn Beaumont version; And an early recording of You can Fly (Sounds like possibly Mitch Miller & the Sandpipers). Real Cool! Sorry I don't have the number available, but it is in the out of print Golden Treasury series, 1985.
2) 45 RPM (or78 RPM) early versions of the classics, like 4 Songs from Snow White sung by the Mousekateers; Darleen Gillespe's wonderful versions of Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella, & Alice [Darleen, are you out there?]; and the great Golden Record Series featuring Mitch Miller & the Sandpipers.
3) Renditions performed by the Disneyland Singers, released on The DQ series Disneyland Records Label: like -
Songs from the Aristocats and Other Cat songs - These are all excellent and performed well.
4) The Camarata Orchestra "interpretations" series.
5) Joe Reisman Orchestra (RCA records, 1955) -performed almost never heard aditional lyrics on some tracks.
I know I can still find more ( on Ebay, of course). But, I'm in a hurry, although not late, and today is my birthday. Wanted to share these with you, sorry the photo turned out terrible, with my 2.0 megapixel
 
W

wondergreg

Tim and I are scouring the countryside (figuratively) trying to dig up information on who exactly is singing on those "second cast" versions of movie music, and why there were made in the first place. Here are a few tidbits: the "Alice in Wonderland" Camarata / Darlene album was made because Disney did not have the recording rights to the soundtrack music (until Randy Thornton, God bless him, brought the whole music soundtrack to CD in the 90's for the first time). Some second cast Lp's were actually demos to test out the songs for approval. Tutti Camarata told me that was the case with the Marni Nixon version of Mary Poppins, though Gloria Wood sang the vocals originally. Sometimes the second cast is in many ways better than the original, for example, John Davidson's rendition of "Dakota," is far surpassed by an uncredited Gene Merlino on STER-1316. Gosh, we should write a book about this -- wait a minute, we ARE!
 
J

Jessica L

Member
Someone surpassed my Johnny? That's upsetting! :-[

;)


Jessica
 
S

Steve Carras

Member
Thanks, TIm and everyone for posting this.Sorry,esp.with my OWN thread here on this topic for the late reply but I didn't entirely notice it until a few weeks back.

I became VERY sued to Robie Lester as Piglet.Tigger=Sam Edwards,etc.before respetively, finding out John Fielder as Piglet, and Recalling Paul Winchell as Tigger.

Hanna-Barbera and Warner Bros.scartoons did many second cast rrecordings only with original stories for the albums (Paul Frees instead of Daws Butler as Huck Hound, and some unidentifiable soul as Bugs Bunny on Columbia while Mel Blanc was playing Bugs over at Capitol-contractual reasons,obviously in that CASE.fINACES AND OTHER EEASONS APPLY..)
 
M

Michael Zielski

Member
Tim or Greg, or anyone--I have a still-sealed "second cast" LP of Babes in Toyland, which, according to the All Things Thurl website, has Thurl Ravenscroft taking Ray Bolger's part of Barnaby--true? Any other comments about it?

It's always a little tough opening those mint LP's......

Mike
 
T

Tim Hollis

Member
You are correct about Thurl, but the BABES IN TOYLAND second cast LP is a little different in that only the songs are re-created. The non-musical portion consists only of Ginny Tyler narrating as Little Boy Blue. However, the songs are all well done and distinctively the Camarata style. Thurl sings the Barnaby role, Bill Lee does Gonzorgo, Bob Grabeau is Tom, and Teri York is Mary. In fact, Teri has told us that she actually recorded the songs before the movie was filmed, and they would give her versions to Annette to take home and study before performing the songs in the film.

Because of finding so much info like this, the Disneyland Records book MAY POSSIBLY run a bit behind its projected schedule, but it's going to be well worth the wait. I think we're all more interested in it being complete more than getting it out in a hurry (our publisher might beg to differ, though......).
 
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Michael Zielski

Member
Thanks for your confirmation, Tim; I figured Brian's Thurl site was probably correct, but thought you might have some interesting additional "pearls" to add--thank you! The shrink wrap will definitely have to be opened.....

I know it'll be in your book, but can you tell us the real "philosophy" behind having these "second cast" LP's? Was it simply to provide a less expensive alternative to orginal soundtrack recordings?

Michael
 
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Steve Carras

Member
Thanks for your confirmation, Tim; I figured Brian's Thurl site was probably correct, but thought you might have some interesting additional "pearls" to add--thank you! The shrink wrap will definitely have to be opened.....

I know it'll be in your book, but can you tell us the real "philosophy" behind having these "second cast" LP's? Was it simply to provide a less expensive alternative to orginal soundtrack recordings?

Michael
Click to expand...

I think I can.

I've pointed out countless times, (from the Jim Hill Media site on TIGGER (Sam Edwards)'s death), that the reaosn for such cast substitutions was that Disney didn't believe in syngergy, coupled with the fact that Winchell was more a top liner then, so it'd be easier just to have someone else.

Toonzone.net,by the way, in GOLDEN AGE CARTOONS: CHILDRESN RECORDS had a link to a breif audio file of the 1962 A CHILD'S INTRODUCTION TO MELODY (see BUGS BUNNY's AN IMPOSTER - -[alt.animation.warner-bros.] and PAUL WINCHELL's TIGGER SUPPLEMENT [rec.arts.animation][ - - - these are the EXAMPLES of which NG's I posted 'em to!) with the once-Bill Thompon-voiced, no accent Prof.Owl being done by a thickly Ger,manic THurl Ravenscroft!

(Buttressed by Gloria "Penelope Pinfeather" Wood and Bill Lee - Bertie Birdbrain-P.P. was the brain, B.B. the hick dunce bird). Very surreal to hear these with different voices as I've seen the cartoons these were based oN! Gloria Wood si different soudning than the chick doing Penelope the briany bird for the toon).

Anyway, There are a few Columbia Bugs Bunny records sans Mel Blanc (or the several supporting voices like June Forya,l Bea Benadaret or Elmer Fudd' A.Q.Bryan) and ahlf the Hanna Barbera HBR records are likewise-recast!! (To quote The Beatles: Very strange.)

There was an obvious limit to what some of the original Disney actorls, (or others mentioned) would or could do. However it's prety odd not just hearing (if you've ever seen AN ADENTURE IN MUSIC: MELODY or the Academy Award-winnijng TOOT, WHISTLE PLUNK & BOOM which along with the record mentioned and a 1959 Disney TV show extension completes the Prof.Owl franchise*) Bill Thompson and Co.as the bird but other DIsney regulars.. Also according to a Sam Edwards site (NOT JimHillMedia.com this time) Edwarsds was featured ALONGSIDE..drum roll. Sterling Holloiway as Fred MacMurray's ABSENTMINDED PORFESSOR (kinda like Annette and Hayley pinching for each other.:Or Jimmy Durante and Jimmie Dodd filling in--- Great Vaudevillians, excellent Disney-friendly performers but if they eahc did a clasic voice for a flick and the other stepped it, it's odd.Speaking of which,not only did Hanna Barbera have Daws Butler for a logistically unavaible Arnold Stang as the very hip Top Cat but Stang himself - yet another distinctive supposed one voicer -- was basing his charactizastion on Phil Silvers--this was a BILKO spoof.)

In retrospect then we can be perhaps luckily that WInnie thew Pooh even with Hal Smith and Jim Currimngs sounds ast least reasonably like Holloway..

But the it's varying between movie and disc in the department of "second-casters". As I mentioned, Thurl Ravenscorft's interpretation of the shortlived Prof.Owl is muchaccented, deep and different - unlike Bill Thompson's accent-free and more light voiced cartoon verison. However Sam Edwards almost got Tigger nailed PERFECTLY with all due apologiers to Paul Winchell!








NOTES
*There may ahve been a few other Disney records and Sundya night and Mickey mouse shows with prof.Owl but with Donald's unclee Ludwig who needs that Owl? ;D
 
N

narkspud

Member
As I mentioned, Thurl Ravenscorft's interpretation of the shortlived Prof.Owl is muchaccented, deep and different - unlike Bill Thompson's accent-free and more light voiced cartoon verison.
Click to expand...

Ah, but it works both ways. I had that "Music How It's Made and Played" LP long before I ever saw the two cartoons on which it was based. And my reaction was "How come the Thurl owl sounds like Droopy?"
 
makeminemusic

makeminemusic

Member
Tim and Greg,
I haven't been to this site in awhile, so forgive my late post on this topic. Are you still researching for your book on second cast recordings? We had the pleasure of having Ginny Tyler come and speak at our last NFFC meeting here in the northwest. Being a collector of Disney vinyl it was great to hear and talk to her about her experiences with Disneyland records. If you haven't contacted her and are interested let me know. Looking forward to seeing your book!

Ken
 
T

Tim Hollis

Member
Oh yes, Ginny is a good friend of ours and a delightful little lady. We have turned in the first six chapters (through 1964) to the publisher as of today, and it is making rapid progress. We MAY not hit the original October 2005 publication date, but hopefully it will appear sometime between then and January 2006. Hang on to your hats!!!!
 
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