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Wonderland Music comment

Discussion in 'Archive' started by Michael Zielski, Mar 26, 2004.

  1. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Having been a Walt Disney record collector(amongst other musical interests, don't worry--been on a Bernard Herrmann kick with my son for the past several weeks) over the past several years, of course I was excited when the current Disneyland Wonderland Music series got underway last year. I've found that even a sealed, mint LP does not guarantee flawless sound; digital sound has definitely spoiled me. I think I must have just learned to ignore the obligatory "pops" way back when--except when the needle got stuck.

    I finally have all eight of the LP reissues that have been released so far. I won't even attempt a comment on the audio--that's been covered by the experts on board. I've been happy simply to have a recording without the usual vinyl annoyances.

    What I can comment on, though, is the absence in the CD packaging of any contempoary documentation. I certainly love the original album art/notes, but why nothing more? No track listing(the tracks appear to be based on the original LP tracks, for the most part, as I have some of the original vinyl recordings), no mention of the restoration process or credit to those involved, and no additional, interesting historical facts regarding the original recordings themselves(for example, how about the CBJ performers?). Any of this information usually accompanies a reissued recording; Randy did all of this(and more!) on his "famous" CD set several years ago.

    Just wondering if some of this kind of documentation could be done on future releases; it could certainly only enrich the entire package. If the effort is being made to release this music again, why not do it properly? Granted, some listeners simply may not be interested, but that's always the case. It seems only fitting to have some additional "pearls" of information included with these musical treasures--many of us do care.

    Mike
     
  2. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    > If the effort is being made to release this
    > music again, why not do it properly?

    Cuz it's still Michael's company and if there's any way he can get people to cut corners, he'll get people to figure them out and follow through.

    IMHO.

    http://www.savedisney.com

    -Sharon-
     
  3. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    I suppose I was guessing that that would probably be the reason, Sharon--but it's still amazing to me! Even the tiniest record companies producing CD's of reissued material make the effort to have interesting and educational information included about the music, particularly with regards to old jazz/blues recordings; hell, for that matter, even the long-awaited recently re-released old Lovin' Spoonful albums(from a smaller label) had some great linear notes and photos, to put a more contempoary/pop take on the issue!

    The fact that a company like the WDC can't do this is just plain sickening.

    Mike

    P. S. Still gotta get my SaveDisney bumper sticker on my truck, in its rightful spot, next to my "Support the Right to Arm Bears" sticker from the Great Lost Bear watering hole in Portland.
     
  4. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    Mike-

    Don't get me wrong...nobody outside the "Iron Disney Curtain" knows for sure why the quality of those CDs' packaging is so bad, least of all me. But based on nearly everything else that's come of out the Disney Think Tank in the past 10 years or so, it certainly makes sense.

    BTW, when I wear my "saveDisney.com" T-shirt to WDW, I get a LOT of (whispered) compliments from line AND management CMs alike .

    -Sharon-
     
  5. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Yeah, I know you're just theorizing.....but like you say, it is based on some prime circumstantial evidence, as they say.....

    SaveDisney t-shirt, huh--I need one for our April WDW trip; you must've got it from the website?

    Mike
     
  6. Disney Bean Counte

    Disney Bean Counte Member

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    At the risk of being chastised for going off topic...again

    Yes those Lovin' Spoonful Reissues were nice.
     
  7. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    "......no one pitchin' cuz there ain't no batter, in Coconut Grove....."

    Yep--have to agree with Peter Buck's comments on the back of the "Hums" CD, that it should be up there on the shelf with some of the other 60's classics; sorry to hear of Zal's passing last year. That album has held up over the years, and I was happy find it on CD last year(had a hard time getting used to the stereo effect, compared to my mono LP). Oh yeah, one other thing, getting back to Disney, somewhat.....we were in Virgin Records at Downtown Disney, last trip in August, and what should I spot, but a reissued vinyl version of "Hums"--it was tough, but I resisted that warm retro-vibe, and passed it up......damn........

    Mike
     
  8. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    Mike-

    My husband and I went to the Stockholders' meeting as well as Roy and Stanley's rally the day before...R&S gave gift bags to all attendees, which included the T-shirt (they even had 2 or 3 sizes of shirts, bless their hearts!), a pin, a button, a pen, a plastic-covered notepad and a bumper sticker...will with varying forms of the saveDisney.com logo on them. Had to have cost them a fortune!

    -Sharon-
     
  9. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Darn......there's always ebay.....but just thinkin'.......my SaveDisney bumper sticker might look kinda cool slapped across an old Mickey t-shirt, walkin' right down the middle of Main Street, USA.....might catch an eye or two......

    Uh........what was the topic again???

    Mike

    ADDENDUM: Sharon, just checked--only thing I could find was two people hawkin' the SaveDisney pin.......but that might work, too.......
     
  10. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    Roy and Stanley did suggest/request that we continue the spread the word until the fight is over. I wear my shirt as often as I can without people thinking it's the only shirt I own (I also don't want to wear it out too fast...though it IS a name-brand labeled shirt). The pin is kinda small (and the original clasp is a butterfly clip...so if you DO get one, use a different clasp) but the button is a nice 4 incher.

    -Sharon-
     
  11. Disney Bean Counte

    Disney Bean Counte Member

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    Yes...Zal was the cool one when we were kids...the longest hair...making those funny faces...he was man enough to hook up with Cass Elliot. ;-)

    My Save Disney Bumpersticker was taped on my luggage last month....Oh no....I'm going to tell a vacation story....someone hold me back...I can't help it...

    I stuck it on my shirt to dinner at the Flying Fish (just to see what would happen). I'm not going to discuss our meal...FOCUS....FOCUS...

    Our server said that it is a very popular sentiment among cast-members right now. However they are warned repeatedly at staff meetings not to discuss this topic with guests.
     
  12. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    Joe and I are going to take one of our bumper stickers and get one of those bumper sticker magnet things for it, so we can hang it on our fridge (we don't like the idea of permanently affixing the sticker to our car and I'm quite sure it would disappear if we only used a magnet for it on our car).

    The closest I've gotten to a conversation with a CM onstage is when he said he liked the shirt, where did I get it and (once I told him) what was the rally/meeting like. The rest have been brief, simple, quiet "I like your shirt" sort of things.

    -Sharon-
     
  13. Tim Hollis

    Tim Hollis Member

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    SHAMELESS PLUG TIME: Maybe the reason Randy Thornton isn't issuing any sort of historical background on his CD's is that he knows everyone will be able to get that data from the forthcoming THE WALT DISNEY RECORDS STORY book by yours truly and Greg Ehrbar (still scheduled for October 2005, although the publisher will delay it until Spring 2006 if time runs out and the manuscript has some distance to go). It's going to be bursting its binding with surprises and information that has never, ever appeared in print before... In fact, I can hardly wait to read the finished thing myself.
     
  14. FRAN?OIS

    FRAN?OIS Member

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    Ah, well, let's be positive -- something elusive lately here! --

    We can listen to "cd versions" of those treasures right now, even if there are no booklets, which, btw, or SO HARD TO READ at times!

    Correct me if i'm wrong, but those cds are, theorically, only available at the Disneyland store on Main Street; a special market.

    Great news, Tim, even if we have to wait that long!

    I don't have new news re: Dame Julie at this time!
    I know our two friends will be disappointed!
    C'est la vie!
     
  15. atomobile

    atomobile Member

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    Hello,
    I agree with Francois about this message board being on the negative side lately. Last time I defended the Wonderland system, i got some really nasty replies. That is why I stopped posting for a while. I agree that it would have been nice to have full booklets with detailed restoration information. At the same time, I'm glad we have original covers and track listings included. I also think it's great that the tracks are not split up like the Forever system was. I remember back in the days when the Forever system was installed that we were all happy to be able to get the tracks even though the audio quality varied, there was no real artwork other than the generic cover, and the tracks were split up into chucks at the most innapropriate places. I don't remember people complaining as much about the Forever system. Also, regarding the audio quality issues, I don't want to re-ignite the same flamings I got about this subject, but if you fairly listen to all 8 re-releases, the quality is always better than the original master was. They didn't spend thousands of dollars remixing and restoring the tracks, but I wouldn't expect Disney to spend that kind of money for such an experimental project with such a small audience. Like I said before, if we support the system and make it profitable for them, maybe they can pay the attention it needs. In the meantime, I an happy that we at least have access to this material. I think it's an upgrade to the old Forever system and I will continue to support it. The system is just in it's starting period. About a dozen new first-time-on-cd album are expected to be released any day now. In the near future, most of the Forever tracks will return better than they ever were before and not split up. They are slowly working on more releases and better ways to market it. This is a small operation that will grow and get better as they learn how to deal with it. Be patient, and enjoy the new music available. You will have a hard time finding a better sounding version of America Sings, Walt Disney Takes You to Disneyland, Country Bear Jamboree, and Golden Horseshoe, etc as what is available in the Wonderland system. And another shameful plug to the Disney Records Story Book. I can't wait for it. (Tim, I haven't forgotten about you, I will send some vintage Chilling, Thrilling artwork soon).
    And just between you and me, I heard some very nice things about the upcoming 50th anniversary set, the Mary Poppins expanded re-issue, and a WDW Official album with a few new attraction material.
    I can't wait for the new Wonderland wave!
    Your friend,
    Louis Gonzalez
     
  16. Tim Hollis

    Tim Hollis Member

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    It's nice to know that someone is anticipating THE WALT DISNEY RECORDS STORY as much as Greg and I are. Just so everyone will know that this is a book having to be written from primary research, because so little information about the record company has been preserved or archived, below is an (approximate) alphabetical listing of the people we have been in contact with for it, and the list is growing every week. If some of these names are not familiar, they will be by the time ypu find out what they did connected with the records!

    Jim Andron; Elli Baer; Charlotte Baker; Gypsy Belew; Lois Blaisch; Larry Blakely; Lucille Bliss; Tom Bocci; Ed Bogas; Bruce Botnick; Derek Boulton; Bob Brunner; Anita Bryant; Fulton Burley; Lonnie Burr; Corey Burton; Tutti & Paul Camarata; Al Capps; Eddie Carroll; George & Dawn Charouhas; Gennifer Johnson Choldenko; Ysanne Churchman; Bill Cole; Gini Colvig; Carol Connors; Kevin Corcoran; Mary Costa; Jerome Courtland; Scott Craig; Mike Curb; Merrill Dean; Walker Edmiston; Sam Edwards; Brian Fahey; Stan Farber; Bill Farmer; Shelby Flint; Mary Espinosa Goff; Desiree Goyette; Marge Grabeau; Larry Groce; Christopher Hibler; Ron Hicklin; Chuck Howerton; Huston Huddleston; Richard Huemer; Brian Ingoldsby; Dorothy Ives; Ann Jillian; Grey Johnson; Jean Kanady; Carol Kaye; Gary Krisel; Sam Kwasman; Lois Lane; Diana & Tim Lee; Robie Lester; Mel Leven; Carol Lombard; Betty Luboff; Guy Maeda; Laurie Main; Burny Mattinson; Dal McKennon; Eddy Medora; Gene Merlino; Bob Mitchell; Rose Mussi; Marni Nixon; Loulie Jean Norman; Laura Olsher; Fess Parker; Patti Parris; George Patterson; Les Perkins; Thurl Ravenscroft; Pete Renoudet; Will Ryan; Paul Salamunovich; the Sherman Bros; Roberta Shore; Gary Shortall; Billy Simpson; Sally Stevens; Billy Strange; Sally Sweetland; the Sylte Sisters; Jim Tadevic; Bob Tebow; Ginny Tyler; Randy Van Horne; Ed Wade; Jackie Ward; Jerry Whitman; Nancy Wible; George Wilkins; Aubrey Woods; Teri York; Alan Young

    If there is anyone missing from that list so far, it is because we either have not found out how to get in touch with them yet, or that no one knows what became of them (such as the mysterious Vonnair Sisters). And much work remains to be done!
     
  17. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Thanks for commenting, Tim--and the "shameless" reminder! The book is going to be an essential companion to the Walt Disney musical experience, hopefully filling a void these CD releases don't seem to be addressing.

    I was trying NOT to write a grumbling, negative post--I hope it didn't come across as such. I was merely trying to offer more of a strong suggestion that many of us would be interested in some additional historical information with regards to the re-released LP's, that could only enrich the listening experience. It certainly seems to be the current standard of excellence in the music industry, that when significant recordings from the past are re-issued, more often than not, there are accompanying interesting facts in the CD booklet. It doesn't strike me as an appropriate cost-cutting arena, if that indeed is the reason for the striking lack of liner notes.

    Just wanted to reiterate.

    Mike

    P. S. Bean, you didn't really stick the sticker on your shirt at dinner, did you? Maybe I can be the first, then, at Jiko's!
     
  18. Eddie Valiant

    Eddie Valiant New Member

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    I tend to agree with Louis' comments - I'm just happy to be able to have these reissues to listen to again, and in a better quality than I could find on a used LP. As for the artwork, I tend to think that they were going for an historical reissue so that the CD would resemble [as closely as possible] the original LP issue which precluded any kind of extended liner notes, etc. Maybe that was a cost cutting measure, I'm not sure, but in the long run I'm happy with what I got and look forward to the next wave to be released [soon I hope!].

    Eddie V.
     
  19. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    I don't think that anyone was UNhappy with them. it's just that it seems every time they do something, they spend less and less money doing it. It doesn't mean that the CDs aren't good...just that they could be better. Just like Journey Into Your Imagination and The Haunted Mansion Movie and the DLP Studios.

    -Sharon-
     
  20. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Right, Sharon--I'm NOT unhappy. Maybe it goes back to one of the things may father always told me(another one of those stories.....), the time-honored "if you're going to do a job, do it right and do the best you can."

    I guess those words just don't apply at the Walt Disney Company nowadays--especially if it's going to cost the ol' "do-re-mi".

    Mike
     

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