The Timekeeper / Le Visionarium

[Horizons]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I seem to have two others in addition to the ones you listed. One is 20:42 long and includes the preshow (it's marked ALD). The other is 17:49 long. I'll compare these with the two you referenced and see if there is any difference.

 

[WDWGuy08]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

There were only two versions of the movie, the original that played in France and the later American version in Magic Kingdom. Two versions with two different scores.

--- Direct Quote from composer Bruce Broughton!

-Chris-

 

[almandot]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I think Bruce is lying. I think we should make a petition to get Bruce to admit he made a 3rd one.

 

[BLM07]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I guess the TDL version had the same score and film as the American version?

And thank goodness they pulled that Raymond Scott music, how in the world does that fit Tomorrowland anyway? It sounds Toontown-like, but not futuristic, then again, maybe they can bring it back with all the cartoons in Tomorrowland now... hmm...

 

[Gurgitoy2]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I guess the TDL version had the same score and film as the American version?

Actually, this I know for certain.? The TDL version was the French version.? There was an english track availible, but it was not the Robin Williams version.? TDL's was installed before they decided to bring the show to WDW, so it is (well...was) identical to the DLP version in every aspect...of the show, that is.

 

[_Indiana_]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Isn't that what got Tomorrowland in trouble with Mrs. Raymond Scott?

I'm hoping someone can elaborate on this.

When the "New" Tomorrowland opened around 1994, I've heard that a different background loop was playing. As far as I know, it was changed to the one that features Bubble Shuffle, Night Fire Dance, The Palace, etc.

I'm guessing that the quoted post is referring to this situation. Can someone shed some light on this for me? Why was it changed? How long did the music play before it was changed?

 

[angiehashemi]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

The sensationalized whisper-down-the-lane version is that Mrs. Raymond Scott was riding Space Mountain one day and heard echoes of her husband's signature tracks. She went ballistic and started picking off random Rocket Jet astronauts with a blow dart. One of the victims fell and was skewered and another fell on a speaker, damaging it in such a way that it amplified the loop. This further angered Mrs. Raymond Scott, who then drove her autopia car off the track and started mowing down anyone with a pin lanyard. The death and destruction was so pervasive that Disney decided to drop the loop in favor of the won we know with the new age songs. Hope that helps.

Bill, you are hilarious! I needed a laugh today! Thanks!

 

[Horizons]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Oh, I thought he was relaying a true story.

 

[FRAN?OIS]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

The sensationalized whisper-down-the-lane version is that Mrs. Raymond Scott was riding Space Mountain one day and heard echoes of her husband's signature tracks.? She went ballistic and started picking off random Rocket Jet astronauts with a blow dart.? One of the victims fell and was skewered and another fell on a speaker, damaging it in such a way that it amplified the loop.? This further angered Mrs. Raymond Scott, who then drove her autopia car off the track and started mowing down anyone with a pin lanyard.? The death and destruction was so pervasive that Disney decided to drop the loop in favor of the won we know with the new age songs.? Hope that helps.

My! That's exactly what happened!!
You took the words right out of my mouth, but, then, I could not have said it better! Even in French!

Good old reliable Bill!

 

[X-S Tech]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I've had this text file on my comp forever. I have no idea where it was first posted but I believe it's been posted here: As far as I know it's the most complete account of the whole Tomorrowland Raymond Scott fiasco. There's also commentary at the end. I don't know who wrote the commentary either:

As you wander through "new" Tomorrowland, does it strike you odd that the soundtrack to the boiler-plate and rivited "Future That Never Was" is the same sleepy New Age music that park has been playing since the 1980s?
It wasn't always this way.

When the rehabed Tomorrowland first opened, it moved to the quirky beat of original Raymond Scott recordings. Scott was the prolific composer of jazz music that would later be remembered by most as being the underscore of several Warner Brothers cartoons. The "B" section of his masterpiece "Powerhouse" usually accompanied cartoon visuals of any assembly-line process or factory.

After a number of months, the scratchy original recordings of Scott's work gave way to newly recorded music which sounded exactly like Raymond Scott songs but were in fact close approximations of the tunes, changed enough it would seem to avoid having to pay royalties. This music cheerily played for several months more, until it too suddenly disappeared, only to be replaced once again by the New Age loop which was played in the "old" Tomorrowland.

I was baffled, as Scott's tunes were the perfect aural counterpart to Tomorrowland's new look. And Esquivel's take on "Harlem Nocturne" was still blaring away in Space Mountain's exit tunnel.

Several years later I discovered the Raymond Scott website (raymondscott.com) and on a page detailing public performances of Scott's works, found this entry:

Tomorrowland - DisneyWorld[sic]: (Orlando, FL) six Scott Quintette compositions and recordings blatantly used as musical template for constantly-running soundtrack loop at renovated theme park attraction; infringement settled out of court (1995-96) So there it was -- Disney was too cheap to pay for Scott's songs and was busted for it.

And it turns out this wasn't the first time the Mouse had tried to rip off Raymond -- the score for "Honey, I Shrunk the Kids" also illegaly used elements of Scott's "Powerhouse," forcing a lawsuit and ultimately a settlement.

*******************

Having repeated all that, I can tell you the following:

1) The Scott soundalikes were composed by George Wilkins.

2) Disney?s use of Raymond Scott?s original recordings was NOT illegal, as their agreement with ASCAP/BMI allows for unlimited use of 3rd-party music, provided that the music cannot be *synchronized* to anything, and used for background ambience only.

3) Having Wilkins write and record the soundalikes, however, may have treaded heavily into the immoral -- and *dangerously* into the realm of plagiarism. As the original writer above notes, Scott's widow *won* a lawsuit against the ripoff music used for "Honey I Shrunk The Kids".

 

[Horizons]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Just curious, is there a copy of the Wilkins version that is higher than 96k, and one that hasn't been chopped up into individual songs?

 

[almandot]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Does any of this story apply to Disneyland's tomorrowland? I'm still not sure I've ever even heard the music in question.

 

[Gurgitoy2]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

No, Disneyland never had the Raymond Scott, or soundalikes play anywhere, so it was exempt from all of this.

 

[BLM07]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

The story was from Jim Hill and the commentary was posted here by sds910 (I think).

 

[_Indiana_]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I was baffled, as Scott's tunes were the perfect aural counterpart to Tomorrowland's new look. And Esquivel's take on "Harlem Nocturne" was still blaring away in Space Mountain's exit tunnel.

Thanks for posting the Raymond Scott information, X-S Tech.

This part of the article caught my attention. Does anyone know if all of Esquivel's Space-Age Bachelor Pad Music album was played in Space Mountain's exit tunnel? The only track I was aware of was Music Makers. Was the complete list of that version of Space Mountain's exit music ever known?

 

[X-S Tech]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Yeah all I've ever heard of playing there was Music Makers and Sentimental Journey. Dunno if Harlem Nocturne did play there.

 

[Horizons]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

I just recall the two tracks as well.

 

[angiehashemi]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

So are you guys really saying that what Bill described earlier happened, or are you poking fun at me (which is OK, by the way)? I thought he was just being his usual hilarious self.

 

[X-S Tech]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Oh great. Call him hilarious- now there'll be absolutely no living with him.

 

[angiehashemi]

Re: Timekeeper Score/show?

Sorry! I guess my sense of humor is a crazy as his is. Don't worry. You won't hear that kind of stuff out of me much. I don't always think of the funny kind of things to say like he does, but I do get a good laugh when he says them!