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Frontierland Loop Question

Discussion in 'Disney Parks and Resorts' started by SeaCastle, Jun 2, 2008.

  1. SeaCastle

    SeaCastle Premium Member Playlist Author

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    I have a Frontierland loop clocking in at 18:55, and 5 "Unknown" tracks, (11, 13, 14, 15, 20), with Polly Wolly Doodle and Old Betsy. Are these tracks related (They are dated 1973)? If so, does that mean this is the loop from '73?

    On a separate note, there is a Tom Sawyer Island loop that plays for 12:22. According to Disney Music Loops, this loop is the WDW one, but I have heard otherwise. Can someone clarify?

    Thanks,
    ~Tropics
     
  2. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    As far as I can tell, there have been three Frontierland BGMs. There is a separate discussion on this topic.

    http://www.magicmusic.net/discuss/index.php?topic=3425.0

    The tracks you are referring to, if my memory is correct, are cut from the 1971 loop which runs about 45 minutes (20 tracks in total, although the last cut track fades out).

    The Tom Sawyer's Island BGM that you have should have an abrupt ending and, thus, is not complete. There is a (complete?) recording that runs 29:01, although I don't know if this particular version circulates to a wider group. My copy is dated 1983 and I don't know if there was a version before or after this one, or whether this track is indeed specific to WDW (although I have no reason to suspect it isn't).

    Member nelsonj3 and I scoped out the island on Saturday looking for things to record. We noticed a dedicated loop at Aunt Polly's, but did not confirm whether it was the same as the 29 minute version.
     
  3. X-S Tech

    X-S Tech Active Member

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    Nope, Aunt Polly's loop should be totally unique Horizons.
     
  4. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    Interesting. There was no other music playing on the Island, other than at Aunt Polly's. However, I am not sure this was always the case. I think the best I can do at Aunt Polly's is a live reference recording (unless I do the Drinking Around the World tour with Pigs on the Wing first)
     
  5. DL FLIGHT 295

    DL FLIGHT 295 Member

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    WDW has had several Frontierland tracks used over time.

    The original Frontierland

    1972-Pecos Bill Cafe
    1971-Mile Long Bar (complete version never on bear band album)
    1973 -General area music (original)
    1973-Aunt Pollys (Tom Sawyer Island) -music was still playing here in 2000 --possibly the same tracks?
    1973-Fort Sam Clemens area (same tracks used for TDL Fort Sam Clemens 1982)
    197?-Frontierland general area music --longer version with "Mighty Dog dog food theme" tune
    197?-Frontierland "bridge" the area around the Frontierland entry sign and the first block of structures(why these had diifernt tracks
    is unknown, except Jack Wagoner would have been paid for his time......so the more music he compiled........etc.etc.
    1990's-Frontierland music changed to include tracks recorded for TDL's Westernland music (many of these tracks were used for DL's Big
    Thunder Ranch 1985/86)

    Also, The Keel Boats (Liberty Square) had it's own tracks.......The Liberty Square Riverboats also had a set of about 5-6 tracks that played while in motion --Disneyland used 3 of these tracks up untill about a year or so....

    and......Harper's Mill had "music" the sound FXs inside the mill featured wood and gears creaking and groaning to the tune "Down By The Old Mill Stream"........The Magnetic Mystery Mine also had a SFX/mysterious music..........

    I'm sure this is not complete............



    DL FLIGHT 295
    aka
    DC 88 SPACELINER
     
  6. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    I hope DL Flight 295 is here to stay (again). I find his older posts, from several years ago, to be a wealth of information.

    Speaking of which, several years ago you were going to post information about the early WDW Main Street USA BGMs, but I never saw the follow-up post. Do you have any information you can pass along?

    Also, do you have any information about the entrance/queue BGM for The Enchanted Tiki Room / Under New Management attraction at WDW?

    Thanks!
     
  7. DL FLIGHT 295

    DL FLIGHT 295 Member

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    Hmmm.......The Early DL/WDW music tracks. These Played from the early 70's till the EDL tracks were used. They were comprised (mostly) of needle drops from record albums like "Your Father's Moustache Vols One and Two" "The Naughty 90's" and "23-Skidoo" all by Professor white and his gaslight Orchestra. Also some tracks from "Our Century in Music" a series of albums sold thu magazines in the 60-'s and 70's.

    The first was a short reel that was made for WDW's opening......it featured the track "Daring young man on the Flying Trapeeze"....by 1974/75 Jack Wagoner created a NEW Main Street BGM for use at WDW and DL. These newer rels used most of the tracks from the early WDW short reel--minus the trapeeze song! This time he made lengthy reels AND created a "AM" playlist and a "PM"playlist. (I recall this had something to do with WDW's Magic Kingdom staying open later at nite-so DL benefitted from WDW's operation)

    The origianl Crystal Palace music at WDW also used tracks from some of those albums as well as others and later also played as the BGM for the Plaza Inn at DL. At some point in the 80's the Crystal Palace BGM was changed with new music that also was used at TDL's Crytal Palace.

    The ORIGINAL Enchanted Tiki Room (at DL )used a reel featuring the tropical music of Martin Deney....this must have been changed by the late 60's early 70's as diferent bgm music played (called Tiki Lanai) that had no bird sfx and calls and was much slower in tone. At WDW I have no idea what actually played at TROPICAL SERENADE........Sunshine Pavillion and Adventureland Verandha all had there own tracks. "Under New Management" was playing tracks from Authur Lyman and Martin Denny, but I can't specify the individule tracks.



    DL FLIGHT 295
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    DC 88 SPACELINER
     
  8. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    You're killing me here - - Two versions of the Crystal Palace and Tropical Serenade BGMs? The list is supposed to be getting shorter, not longer.

    Thanks for the information. Do you have playlists for the early WDW Main Street USA BGMs? The reason I ask is that I was given two sets of tracks, each supposedly from the same period, so they both can't be correct.

    Thanks again.
     
  9. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    I'll have to visit with the resident expert on Arthur Lyman and Martin Denny music, Pigs on the Wing. This information is also consistent with his daughter's observation of "Hawaiian War Chant" being played in the queue. Given this, it's likely the entire BGM can be easily identified.
     
  10. dkrfla

    dkrfla Member

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    I have tried a few times without much luck to record the music in the waiting area inside the tiki room just to try and identify the tracks. The waterfall is so loud though that I cannot hear my recordings well enough to tell what they are. It seems to me that there is always one other song and "Quiet Village" by Martin Denny. I am not sure however if the other song changes or if it is the same song all the time. It was the same twice when I was there I am sure of. Also there is the other factor of me not knowing or having access to every Martin Denny song he recorded to compare my crappy live recording to. I tend to go to the Tiki room everytime I am there and when I go back I will yet again try to get a clearer recording.

    Also, it seems to me that last year there was a music loop playing just outside the tiki room but the last time I was there I didn't hear it. Anyone know for sure? Also is there still music playing outside the Sunshine terrace?

    Dusty
     
  11. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    This is the loop I was referring to, the one you can hear right before you enter the turnstiles to walk into the queue. I have heard a loop in this area for years, I just never sat down and listened to it (plus, I know almost nothing of the Hawaiin lounge music POTW provided links to, at least not yet).
     
  12. DL FLIGHT 295

    DL FLIGHT 295 Member

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    If you have two set tracks from the same period, you have the Main Street USA AM set (daytime) and the PM set (nitetime) this two reel set was done (mainly for WDW) in the mid 70's......Early on WDW didn't stay open very late......designers didn't think people would stay at the Magic Kingdom very long after sunset.......Rolly Crump from WED was at one time in charge of overall lighting for Disneyland and was art director for WDW's Fantasyland dark rides --he said when WDW opened there was no nitetime atmosphere lighting plan-other --than the castle and the gimbal lights on Main Street (lampposts around the park too ofcourse!) Anyway, by the later part of the early 70's Disney realized guests were willing to stay later. Disneyland didn't have BGM music for Main Street (themed anyway) Jack Wagoner was really focused on WDW's opening, He said that when he started giving some attention to Disneyland he was really surprised that general musak was playing along main street .......tunes from The Carpenters etc. He fixed that pretty fast.

    Anyway-----I'm rambling: Main street at WDW & DL by 74-75.......I can't recall the exact dates (I can find out!) ......started using the extended AM & PM track sets. The AM should feature the song "Pretty Baby" ....the the baby cry(wah-wah)....... I think the AM track features faster past tracks (to get guests thru and into the rest of the park) and the PM features slower tracks (to get guests to slow down, relax and spend some money...ah.er.I mean TIME!) Actually I do not recall what the real reasons were for both sets...but I think it was something regarding guest movement.


    Now, one more thing about the Tiki Room & Tropical Serenade:

    DISNEYLAND in 1963 used Martin Denny Exotic music in it's Tiki Garden area--these must have been needle drops.....as the bird calls are all left in (and to me sounds more South American in style than Hawaiin). At some point DISNEYLAND changed this music to a more Hawainn slow....ambiant track set. I think this was in the late 60's --Untited Airline changed it's corporate logo and marketing at this time, so I think a major rehab removed the Martin Denny tracks--which would have been rather dated to people by that time as Martin Denny was also very well known. This slower music would have played up untill the mid 90's at least.

    Now for TROPICAL SERENADE: I have no idea what played in the load area for that show. When TIKI ROOM UNDER NEW MANAGEMENT opened, they used Martin Denny and Artur Lyman tracks.........also needle drops but from re-issued CDs--I don't kow the track listings.
    Currently I do not know what plays there.


    whew!



    DL FLIGHT 295
    aka
    DC 88 SPACELINER
     
  13. dkrfla

    dkrfla Member

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    These are the tracks of the Disneyland Main Street Area Music loop that I have dated from 1971:

    AM loop

    1. Robert E. Lee
    2. Put Your Arms Around Me
    3. Wild Cherries -
    4. Saxema
    5. Saddle Back
    6. The Old Grey Mare
    7. The International Rag
    8. Maple Leaf Rag
    9. Black and White
    10. Golden Arrow
    11. Pretty Baby
    12. King Chanticleer
    13. Mississippi Cabaret
    14. Good Old Timers
    15. Silver Heels
    16. Razzazza Mazzazza
    17. Flying Arrows
    18. Everybody's Doing It
    19. Tickle the Ivories
    20. Old Timers Waltz

    All by Albert White and the Gaslight Orchestra from "Your Fathers Mustache" pts. 1 and 2

    PM Loop

    1). Strolling Thru The Park
    2). Bicycle built For Two
    3). Annie Rooney
    4). In The Good Ol Summertime
    5). Tarmany Picnic
    6). After The Ball
    7). Sidewalks Of New York
    8). And The Band Played on
    9). Horse Cars
    10). Sweet Rosie O Grady
    11). School Days
    12). Man On The Flying Trapeze

    All from the album "The Gay Nineties"' by the Gaslight Bowery Orchestra.

    Could this list it possibly be from WDW or is this actually Disneylands list or both or neither? ;D

    Dusty
     
  14. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    I believe #7, which is unidentified in your list, is "Sidewalks of New York." The PM loop matches what I have. I need to check the AM loop, and then compare these tracks to the other 20+ tracks I received which is supposed to be from the same era, and which, of course, were different (from what I recall).
     
  15. Horizons

    Horizons Playlist Author

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    What I think I have, but need to find the hard drive with the tracks, are a set of AM/PM tracks, PLUS, another set of 20+ tracks that, if I am remembering correctly, were not the same as what was included in the AM/PM set. I was told that both of these were from the early 1970's, but I haven't been able to determine how many MSUSA BGMs have played since the park opened, and whether one or both of these sets are actually from WDW. However, from your posts above, it appears that at least 3 versions have been used; opening day, am/pm set, and the current version.

    I'll look at what I have in the next day or so.
     
  16. DL FLIGHT 295

    DL FLIGHT 295 Member

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    DKRFLA:


    I think you PM track listing is the 1971 original (WDW) only Main Street BGM.......that is the one with the "Flying Trapeeze" tune. Also it's far to short to be the later AM/PM set.

    all your songs listed are from the Professor White sources, however, the actual BGM reels used include those with other tracks from other people like "Our Century in Music" etc. You seem to have a compilation made of the actual albums.



    DL FLIGHT 295
    aka
    DC 88 SPACELINER
     

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