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Bye to Vault Disney

Discussion in 'Archive' started by GrizzlyHall, Aug 23, 2002.

  1. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    Vault Disney is scheduled to be terminated next month! :'( Catch it before September 9th to see the final episodes of the Ink and Paint Club, Mickey Mouse Club, the original Disneyland/Walt Disney Presents/Wonderful World of Color specials, Zorro, etc. This makes me pretty angry and depressed...I hope there can be a new channel based on Disney's History...where else can we actually see Walt nowadays on the TV? :mad: :-[ :'(
     
  2. dannyeyheralde

    dannyeyheralde Member

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    Disney REALLY must like September 9th as the day to end things. First the Playhouse, now Vault Disney. What next????
     
  3. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    And where is Walt in the Walt Disney Company?

    Is he going extinct?

    If the COP is going, Walt Disney World will have to change name. If Vault Disney goes...maybe the name "Disney" has to go. Anyway, it's more Eisner, less Walt. And I'm getting sick of it. :'(
     
  4. dannyeyheralde

    dannyeyheralde Member

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    OH GOD I can just picture it now, Eisnerland,Eisner World,Tokyo Eisnerland,Eisnerland Paris & Hong Kong Eisnerland. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
     
  5. nWoJeffDW

    nWoJeffDW New Member

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    Where are you all getting this info? What changes exactly are happening. I haven't hear until today about it so I'm wondering where I can go to get more info.
     
  6. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    I've been told by two people - both who have not given me sources. However, to add to this, Vault Disney is now showing marathons each night for a specific theme. Sunday and Monday were Disney parks. Tuesday and Wednesday were Mickey Mouse Club...and from now until about Sept. 6th or 7th (maybe longer), Episodes of Zorro will be shown. Shucks... I really wanted to see the MK Opening Celebration or Ludwig Von Drake episodes.

    But missing Walt Disney from television is pretty depressing. COP is also closed now...where's anyone to go to see the great man? :'( We need people like Walt in today's times - and shows like the Carousel of Progress - this is all Walt's spirit...and I'm sure a channel called Vault Disney (with good advertisement!) would appeal to many audiences. :'( Even the Carousel of Progress would have superior crowds (like it needs any more! :D) if it was well-marketed. But unfortunately, that isn't the case.

    It's time to put in the VHS'...but it's a shame not being able to see our uncle and hero on the air.

    He'll be back...one day.
     
  7. nWoJeffDW

    nWoJeffDW New Member

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    I took a look at what Disney will be showing starting September 9. According the the online tv matrix, After Playhouse Disney is over, it looks as though the Disney Channel becomes the Rerun show, broadcasting the same block of Even Stevens, Lizzie McGuire, So Weird, Boy Meets World and a few others MORE THAN 3 TIMES IN A SINGLE DAY!

    Now, I kinda like Boy Meets World, Lizzie McGuire and Even Stevens, but why would I want to watch the same episodes 3 times in one day?

    This is stupid lazy programming. I thought Eisner was trying to bring the quality of Disney up, not further cheapen it. :mad: :'(
     
  8. SFMike

    SFMike Member

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    Gee Danny...Look around. We already have have Eisnerland and that lame monstosity is called Disney's Calfornia Adventure. We also have it's european counterpart Disney's Studios Paris. So far we have seen the stamp of Eisner on a park result in the kiss of death as far as quality and park attendance is concerned. If the corporate offices wern't so deluded and filled with yes men maybe they could see a pattern. Oh I forgot the low attendance at these parks is due to 9-11 and the economy....we'll keep telling ourselves that.

    nWoJeffDW said"I thought Eisner was trying to bring the quality of Disney up, not further cheapen it." Hate to burst your bubble nWoJeffDW but all Eisner is doing is making sure that his overinflated salary keeps coming in at the expense of the entire corporation. What the public wants is of no concern to him as he and his lackeys continue to strip mine what is left of Walts legacy. Quality is a word that he does not understand. PROFITS are the end all be all. Since he can not grasp the idea that the two concepts might work together it's way past time for the Disney board of directors to cut this albatross loose. I don't believe we will ever see quality return to The Disney Studio, ABC, or the theme parks until Eisner and his demolition team is gone.

    Sorry for the rant but I too love Vault Disney. The old programming is the only thing that interests me on the now lame Disney channel. Just compare Disney's current kids lineup to Nickelodeon and it's easy to see the lack of creativity and understanding of the TV market that Eisner has. So it's not surprising that now he will screw up what is left of interest to some of us on the Disney channel. Let's face it the Disney channel hit the skids a few years ago about the same time the Disney Stores became the discount childern's clothier that they now are. He has screwed them up also...but that's another story. For more fun read:
    http://www.fool.com/news/foth/2002/foth020809.htm
     
  9. SharonKurland

    SharonKurland Active Member

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    SF Mike-

    Bravo!

    -Sharon-
     
  10. will

    will Member

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    Found this on IMDB/Studio Briefing News site:

    PROTESTERS TELL DISNEY: REOPEN THE "VAULT"
    A decision by the Disney Channel to replace its "Vault Disney" block of late-night "classic" programming from the '50s and '60s with modern shows aimed at teenagers has drawn fire from older viewers who have launched a petition drive aimed at reversing the change, the Los Angeles Times reported today (Tuesday). "They are trying to walk this tightrope of keeping their classic Disney going and appealing to a younger market and staying contemporary," Janet Wasko, a professor of communications studies at the University of Oregon, told the Times. "That's a difficult task for them because there is such emotional attachment to Disney products and characters. People just don't react the same when other companies change their product lines, but Disney is different."
     
  11. David S.

    David S. Member

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    Thanks, Will. Here's one from the Orlando Sentinel. I don't want to go on too much, but needless to say, I find the comments of Disney pinhead, er, executive Richard Ross completely idiotic, contradictory, and laughable. Apparently this guy is unaware that the programming is adjusted for the different timezones such as the west coast. What this guy is REALLY saying is that the parent co. doesn't give a **** (use your imagination to fill in the word of your choice!) about the older viewers (or younger ones with taste). They say they are a "family" channel but I guess WE aren't considered part of that family. Heaven forbid some Zooger who thinks words that end with an "S" end with "Z" instead should wake up in the middle of the night when they are supposed to be in bed and find something good on that otherwise waste of a once great channel.

    What a classy way for the channel to finish out the year of Walt's Birthday Celebration. And those clueless executives with vacuums for souls and burnt out lightbulbs for brains wonder why many kids today don't know Walt was a real person?

    As they say on Zorro, "Baboso, idioso, stupido!"





    Disney puts classics back in vault

    By Richard Verrier | Sentinel Staff Writer
    Posted September 3, 2002

    LOS ANGELES -- For Disney Channel executives, the
    decision seemed a no-brainer: replace vintage Disney
    television shows that run in the dead of night with
    newer, hipper fare targeted at a younger, more
    lucrative audience.

    But the seemingly mundane programming change to
    replace the so-called "Vault Disney" classics with
    youthful comedies such as Lizzie McGuire and Kim
    Possible has created an uproar among older, die-hard
    Disney fans, who see the move as the latest affront to
    the company's heritage. Internet chat rooms devoted to
    Disney fans are abuzz with the pending demise of
    Vault Disney. Some are penning protest letters to
    management relating their connection to childhood
    heroes like Zorro.

    One fan has even started a petition in hopes of
    reversing the decision.

    "I'm dumbfounded," said Glendale schoolteacher Sue
    Schuck, 54, who vows to sell her Disney stock in
    protest. "We baby boomers pay for the cable, the
    admission to Disneyland and the Disney products. We
    watched these shows. They are part of our childhood."

    Disney said the decision is simply economics. Older
    shows like Spin and Marty and Davy Crockett just don't
    resonate with the younger audiences that have formed
    the backbone of the Disney Channel's growth over the
    past decade, as it moved from a mostly premium,
    subscriber-fee cable service to a much more widely
    distributed cable network.

    The dispute underscores the problem the Burbank
    entertainment giant faces as it tries to shore up its
    sagging bottom line: how to keep its brand relevant to
    younger kids without offending the baby boomers who
    cling to a very different, often nostalgic vision of the
    Disney of their childhood.

    Such tensions have flared up across Disney's
    businesses in recent years.

    Fans loudly protested a few years ago when the
    company shut down Mr. Toad's Wild Ride at the Magic
    Kingdom in Orlando, one of the original Walt Disney
    World attractions. Baby boomers also complained more
    recently about the newly redesigned Disney Stores,
    saying they cater too heavily to children. Even as
    Disney spent millions celebrating the 100th anniversary
    of Walt Disney's birthday last year, some longtime
    devotees thought the company didn't pay enough
    homage to the company's founder.

    "They are trying to walk this tightrope of keeping their
    classic Disney going and appealing to a younger market
    and staying contemporary," said Janet Wasko, a
    professor of communications studies at the University
    of Oregon and author of two books on Disney. "That's a
    difficult task for them because there is such emotional
    attachment to Disney products and characters. People
    just don't react the same when other companies
    change their product lines, but Disney is different."

    Keeping current is a major goal of the Disney Channel,
    which in six years has grown from 14 million to more
    than 80 million households.

    In contrast to the struggling ABC Network, the channel
    has been an important moneymaker and marketing outlet
    for the parent company, generating $250 million in
    operating income this year, according to some
    estimates.

    Its success stems mainly from a combination of
    live-action movies and original series, such as Lizzie
    McGuire and Even Stevens, that target teens and
    pre-teens, a demographic coveted by advertisers and
    retailers. The channel's latest creation for kids, the
    animated drama Kim Possible, tied with market leader
    Nickelodeon among 6-to-11 years olds after making its
    debut in June, according to Nielsen Media Research.

    The channel launched "Vault Disney" four years ago as
    an umbrella for Disney classic television shows from
    the 1950s and '60s. To make room for the newer
    entertainment, "Vault Disney" programs were pushed
    further into the evening and early mornings hours.
    Ratings dwindled as viewers got tired of seeing the
    same shows over and over and Disney focused its
    energies on developing new programs.

    By next Monday, the four-hour block will be replaced
    altogether with reruns of prime-time shows. Until then,
    the channel is running Davy Crockett and Zorro
    marathons so fans can watch the final episodes.

    Disney Channel executives say they are canceling
    "Vault Disney" to create consistent programming on a
    24-hour basis for kids, whether they're in Hawaii or
    New York.

    "The Disney Channel is a service for kids and their
    families; it's not a general entertainment service for
    everybody," said Richard Ross, the Disney Channel's
    president of entertainment. "We can't be all things for all
    people."

    The channel is better off diverting money it spends to
    carry old shows into developing new programs that will
    generate higher ratings, such as Kim Possible, Ross
    said.

    But he denies the channel is turning its back on its
    heritage. "This is not a slam on the Vault programming,"
    he said.

    Ross notes that the channel next Monday debuts a new
    series called Mickey's House of Mouse with 65
    episodes. Some "Vault Disney" titles are still available on video and DVD, with several
    more to be released next year, he adds.

    Disney is, in fact, under heavy pressure from rivals such as Viacom Inc., Nickelodeon
    and AOL Time Warner's Cartoon Network to ensure that its programs stay current,
    especially as kids programming increasingly shifts from network television to cable TV.

    Even so, fans complain that removing such beloved classics is short-sighted.

    Arlen Miller of Orlando, who buys and sells Disney merchandise for a living, is equally
    baffled.

    "I'm furious about this," said Miller, 49, a lifelong fan of Zorro, the 1950s television
    series starring the wildly popular Guy Williams as a masked avenger. "The Disney
    Channel is not just for 13 to 17 year olds.

    "They are forgetting the foundation that they were created on."

    Richard Verrier can be reached at 1-800-528-4637, Ext. 77936 or
    richard.verrier@latimes.com.

    Copyright ? 2002, Orlando Sentinel
     
  12. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    VERY well put!

    I am sending letters now - I encourange ANYONE who likes Walt or Vault Disney to write!
     
  13. Steve Carras

    Steve Carras Member

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    Folk,s it's not Disney, It'sthe EISNER company!:(
     
  14. Steve Carras

    Steve Carras Member

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    Oh yeah, to the above poster, if Nickelodoen (provided you're referencing the cartoons here) is your idea of BETTER, I'd HATE to think what would the worst be-except Ren and Stimpy and a few others, NONE of the Nicktoons turn me on (not the Simpson looking ones, anyhow).

    Also, David S,welcome..I've read your past posts inthe disney newsgroups and I agree with you, and love your Zooger comments! ;D
     
  15. raz012

    raz012 New Member

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    enough reading, time to respond.

    i like the disney channel as is, and my kids (9 and 12) LOVE it. i can hardly tear them away from Lizzie McGwire, Even Stevens, The Proud Family, Kim Possible ... and i like those shows too. it may not appeal to ALL of you boomers, but it does appeal to some.

    the vault disney items are being released on DVD ... buy 'em and plop them in, you'll have your old shows (i already got my Disneyland set) ... but let's not forget that disney always was about change ... not staying the same forever. if disneyland was like that, we'd still have the mule rides, the flying saucers and the indian village ... and no Big Thunder Mountain Railway, no Space Mountain, no Splash Mountain. if disney channel never changed, we'd still have DTV and Gummi Bears reruns, and would have never gotten Vault Disney in the first place.

    it's time to pass the torch ... let kids enjoy their OWN Disney memories.
     
  16. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    No. It's not about Kids...

    Disney isn't about change. It's about progress. Disney isn't about kids. It's family. Walt Disney wanted Disneyland to be a place where "the parents and the children to have fun together." This was his goal in his classic, family-quality, ever-so-fading programming!

    Wow, would you look at that? A Carousel of Progress!

    But I digress.

    As for Walt Disney Treasures, I can't wait for EPCOT and the MK opening, and the complete Wonderful World of Color and Ludwig Von Drake and complete Chip and Dale and Disneyland... Plus, a big chunk of a LOT of footage from DVDs already produced has been taken out. And it's going to take decades to produce everything on Vault Disney on DVD. But, it's not only that I'm upset that Vault Disney is off the air, but that the Disney Channel seems to be going against its own foundations!

    Disney is about family. For progress can only be achieved with the love and unity neccessary with the basic unit of America: family. It seems to me that the Diseny Channel is kind of becoming "the anti-Family"? Playhouse Disney is focused at toddlers (the programming is not truly enjoyable for both children and adults), Zoog Disney is focused on Teens...and now...where is the bonding between the parents and the kids?

    Walt Disney's programming stood for the fundamental unity of American prosperity and progress - a foundation that has now separated the family into programming for toddlers and programming for teens. This essential unity has therefore been DESTROYED and it is a true blow in the head to call whatever you want to call that programming on the channel Disneyesque.

    Walt's charm, highly entertaining to children of two years to fourty, is the perfect type of entertainment America needs to snuggle up with on an evening. My niece is in love with the Wonderful World of Color episodes (she is six years old) and isn't even a "Disney freak." There are so many elements that appeal to so many groups, that it creates that warmth necessary for a family-style program. And Walt was the best where it came to this. Heck, even his theme park attractions have worked this magic! The entire world can benefit from Walt's vision, tied into his excellent shows. And then they wonder why they are losing money from ABC????

    Great way to ruin his 100th Birthday, huh? Gain money on his name, and then let's take him off the television!! Is this whole 100 YOM thing for money then? What - close down the attraction that Walt wanted to thrive in his parks as long as they existed (COP) - his own living vision of progress - and Disney hasn't even put effort in even advertising it or giving the sense to the public that it stands for their 100 Years celebration?!

    Some may argue that his classic programming is taken off the air - because no one watched it. Well, think of it this way. How is one supposed to watch it when it's on from 1-5 in the morning - I don't know if I'm the only one who does it, but I am someone who sleeps at night.

    Folks say, they can't "please everyone" and "viewing slipped". No, but you have been successful in pleasing families for the past half of a century!! Pulling this off pulls the name Disney off of programming so much that I find it insulting to keep the name on current programming, showing the same shows over and over and over again - eventually losing appeal and causing Disney to lose in the long run!

    I challenge those people to put the show on PrimeTime, maybe put it on after Playhouse Disney from 4PM-6AM (I believe it's splitting off), and put on heavy advertisement. It is very UNREASONABLE to put it on from 1-5 AM where the human needs to sleep!

    It's kinda funny. The "Disney" Channel is kicking the DISNEY fans out...ironic, it's the Disney Channel? All I can say is...Save Walt. And I don't only mean his programming - it's his outlook he set out for his company. Mabye the Disney Company should read Walt's quotations instead of selling them? It'll give them more money in the long run - that's for sure.

    I encourage writing letters...see what happened with Surprise Mornings? Put your heart to it, and anything is possible! That is Walt Disney's message after all, now isn't it????!!!!

    Long live Walt Disney!!
     
  17. David S.

    David S. Member

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    Bravo and well said, Ursus!

    You made several awesome points, I'd like to just echo a few of them:

    Vault Disney programming isn't just for "boomers". I'm not a boomer, I'm technically a "Gen Xer" but my taste is similar to the boomers in many things, including love for Classic Disney movies, music, attractions, etc. Also, as you said, MANY of today's children enjoy classic Disney material. How else does one explain the ongoing popularity of films such as SNOW WHITE AND THE SEVEN DWARFS (from 1937)!

    The Walt material was indeed designed as something that could be a SHARED experience between people of all age groups and even backgrounds, making it VERY family friendly. Modern entertainment (including much of Disney) is becoming more specialized and fragmented, with everything geared toward a specific "target market" age group. These type of things often have little to no appeal to anyone outside of the "target" age group, making anyone but the "target" age group feel "marginalized"

    But Walt always said he was NOT making "kiddie" pictures. He even disliked the "Midget Autopia" at Disneyland because families couldn't SHARE the experience together and eventually got rid of it.

    And lastly, great point about the DVD situation. You can't release a few token Vault Disney DVDs to make up for the literally HUNDREDS of hours of vintage material from the Vault which aired on Vault Disney. So the statement that it's OK to cancel the show because "Vault Disney is now on DVD" is, to put it kindly, not very accurate! And even if they keep releasing Vault Disney DVDs, like you said it will take years to release everything and sadly some of the more obscure treasures from the Vault will possibly NEVER see the light of day on DVD.

    Ursus, if more of the execs had your intelligence, passion, and dedication to the philosophies of Walt, the company would be a better place :)

    David
     
  18. GrizzlyHall

    GrizzlyHall Member

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    Excellent points, David!! I am touched by your posts!! Not sure about the last part, but I am so glad to hear I'm not alone!! :D

    :)
     
  19. Michael Zielski

    Michael Zielski Member

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    Don't get me started again, guys.....
    I was one of the fortunate few who grew up with Walt Disney. I have cherished memories of summer nights, gathering with family, around the color television set of friends fortunate enough to have one, to view Walt's latest incantation of the week. Whenever I hear Walt Disney's voice, it's a comforting transport vehicle back to those times. My wife also feels for those days; and we've always emphasized to our 12 year old son that the word "Disney" refers to a very real, very special man, not a nebulous corporate entity--a man whom a collection of corporate parasites have now chosen to banish from the air, for the sake of potentially more fashionable and hopefully more profitable programming--a man to whom they owe their very careers--and fortunes. Even a young boy like my son realized that the vault programs were "the real Disney"--he could never understand exiling them to the limbo of late-night programming. And now this, cancelled by your own company, with maybe an occasional DVD collection from time to time--if they prove profitable, mind you.
    But hey, let's all happily celebrate Walt's birthday, issue some commemorative, collectible pins and things(as Walt frequently would say), as the Carousel of Progress theater gathers another layer of dust in the darkness. Walt, I'm truly sorry. Michael.
     
  20. Steve Carras

    Steve Carras Member

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    Thought I'd add some more to this.

    Don't know if I made the following comment, BUT-HOUSE OF MOUSER?? Why not show the theatrical cartoons, made and voicedd by PROS? (the current animation epople and talent are NOT what I mean). Warners cartoons were shown for many YEARS on Saturday morning.true they had to be butchered, but if that's what it takes to show the 1930s-1950s, (well those that ain't toally dated to the decadesm,anyhow) as long as at least fivemor more minutes remain, please find an outlet.

    THe new cartoons with Mickey,etc.in short just destroy the character.

    Yet another example of Eaisner not respecting the foundation on which Disney was built. I love the Disney songwriters (unlike the rock stars even of the 1960s, not my cup of tea as MELODY is importnat). And again Nickelodeon's GROSS crap is NO Better than Disney, regarding the comemnt about comparing it to Nickelodeon-I hope that means, both are just as bankrupt though it doesn't sound the case to that earlier poster---what I wouldn't give to compare Disney and Nickelodeon (esp.after dumping Ren and Stimpy's producer) in the same boat.

    I'd said both Disney channell and Nick can go to the land of the devil (a line I learned from the Phil Hendrie show) if not for Lizzie and Even Stevens and a few others that I DO admire, and Nick-at-nite and its sister TV land.:D
     

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